The IICRC is finally listening.

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Wouldn't the IICRC have to first start with the company's that are using the IICRC logo with out permission ? Those are the same company's in your area that are not certified in anything but still use the logo. What would be the point of a large ad campaign such as "look for the logo" when everyone and their brother uses the logo.

The IICRC might have to start with a new piece of paper and work from the bottom up.

Like what was said above, I have never been asked in my 10 years of business if I was IICRC certified. I like the classes , you can learn , but to be certified to me means nothing , nobody cares.
 

Jim Martin

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in all honesty.......you have to fix the industry and the IICRC before I would put my neck on the chopping block and start trying to figure out how to put it in peoples faces.....

for to long anybody can pitch a piece of equipment in a back of a van...grab a sharpie and go write "carpet cleaning" on the side ..( if they could spell it ) and go out and hack up 3 homes a day.....

until we raise the bar and put strict standards on this industry....your just spinning your wheels and will get no where fast....IICRC are not industry standards.......there more like guide lines...that are not enforced and not required to have....Its is and always will be about money until someone steps up and puts strict rules and and people are enforced to comply to them.

here is another example..." approved service provider "...I decided to got through all of this to see if I could get an angle on it I am one of two companies in my dust bowl town that has this....so after I got myself approved...I made up fliers and talk to carpet companies... etc....their reaction was.."they already have cleaners that do it at a cheaper price....and the other company that is also a approved provider has his masters with the IICRC...more patches then a well decorated cub scout and knows nothing about what he is doing.......now and then I get calls and go in after him and clean up his messes....



IMG_3888.jpg
 

Larry B

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Mikey P said:
As for Larry's comment..
Consumers don't listen to the retail stores, manufacturers or installers about cleaning so why would they care about your TV add ?



Maybe for you bud but I get most of my new work from the above.

Mike I wasn't talking about a retail store telling a customer to call so & so because they are good. I'm talking about retail stores telling people to look for the IICRC logo. We do referral work from installers all the time and are not IICRC certified.


Lets face the facts to all this. Who would you hire to clean your carpets

Some guy that all your friends and family have used for years and love?

or

Some smart ass kid that knows everything just because he took a class certified by the IICRC?



You have one of them that comes on here from Nebraska and I would hire Bawb V a million times over before him just because Bawb probably forgot more about carpet cleaning then the kid from IICRC wants to admit he dont know.


I would hire just about anybody that came on a board to ask questions they didnt know before I would hire a guy Just because the IICRC made some money off him.
 

hogjowl

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I suspect that most within the power positions in the IICRC wish they had never let the Lonnie McDonald's of the cleaning industry set that stupid standard requiring prevacuuming. It is comical that having a vacuum on your truck is what differentiates a certified cleaner as opposed to one that is not.

And, as long as that is a standard, there will be certified cleaners who don't follow the "rules."

And, when you also consider the fact that the companies who are really making money in this industry are those who don't prevacuum ... Stanley Steemer, Hagopian, Peaches and Clean, etc ... then you will also reach the conclusion that it is a "standard" that will never be enforced.

Sorry ... that is off topic ... but like always, there was some idiot who brought it up, so I felt compelled to comment on it.
 
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So the IICRC wants to raise awareness to the world about how carpets should be cleaned and by who. That is a tall order. Does the IICRC have the $resources$ to do such a plan? I have done close to 10,000 houses and the IICRC never came up.
I agree that just because a company is IICRC certified doesnt mean they are going to clean in accordance to their guildlines. You can have the customer monitor the cleaning company and report it to the authoritys (IICRC) if they dont do a great job, even though the carpet is 10 years old and never been cleaned.

Its going to be very tough to "brand" the IICRC, just for the simple fact that *majority* of the population dont care. So who really *benefits* more the IICRC or the cleaning company? Will this force every company to *pay* dues to the IICRC? I know alot of companies that are not a certified firm and they do an amazing job, even prevacuuming.

Larry you make some good points. The "hacks" usually take care of themself. If you are good at marketing your message and do good work, youll stay busy and be profitable.
 

Dale

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The consumer knows that being a "member" of something means nothing, if it doesn't verify two points. Yes, two points that a certifying body COULD verify for cleaners that would put them above average cleaners.

1. Test, and prove the actual skills of the cleaners.

2. Verify the integrity of cleaners, by the body first setting the example of integrity themselves. Then only allowing registrants that prove they’re continued integrity.

Here's the question for the IICRC: Does it fit the bill of these two points?

Sincerely,
Dale

PS: If Mr. Zimmerman, or any IICRC personel would like to talk, visit with me I would be happy to. For those of you who don't have other certifications, I have taken enough different ones that I can see to compare.
 

sweendogg

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Dale said:
The consumer knows that being a "member" of something means nothing, if it doesn't verify two points. Yes, two points that a certifying body COULD verify for cleaners that would put them above average cleaners.

1. Test the actual skills of the cleaners.

2. Verify the integrity of cleaners, by the body first setting the example of integrity themselves. Then only allowing registrants that prove they’re continued integrity.

Here's the question for the IICRC: Does it fit the bill of these two points?

Sincerely,
Dale

Dale you make a really good point. To become Certified with karastan, we had book tests but you had to prove that you could seam several differnet types of carpets, including wovens and karalock backings, test for and match patterns. Straigten a pattern error and prove you could stretch properly for the given carpet. And that you could upholster and wrap a stair case without staples. Only about 15 percent of the class passed and became certified and that is very common among that certification. Their standards are higher and as a result the certification means more.
 

Mikey P

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Since Mrs Wagner is afraid to post here, I'll do it for her.

The IICRC has had one of the largest - and yet strangely ineffective - marketing budgets for as long as I've been certified. And their committee of one for years created no trackable results for the hundreds of thousands spent each year.

It's image advertising, and technical focused (what the technoweenies like to read with no idea what is compelling to consumers).

And ... it is not direct response, and it is not trackable. It's throwing money in the wind.

I remember pleading with the then marketing director Ruth to please put different phone extensions in ads so they could at least be tracked to see which was more effective ... and explaining some of the basics of marketing to the group back then (which included Lee) - was like talking Spanish to English speakers.

A commercial on Oprah? Are you serious?

Why not spend a fraction of that amount on hiring an actual marketing expert to force advertising that is trackable and can show you what each and every dollar is generating in return in terms of calls.

If IICRC could actually show the performance of their advertising then they could create some cooperative advertising opportunities for certified firms wanting to generate even more jobs.

I have not received a referral from IICRC for years ... probably because I need to shut my mouth on this. :)

Oprah. TV ads. Movie house. Ads in Good Housekeeping. Give me a break.

It's not where you advertise that's the IICRC's problem - but the people they are hiring (PR agencies) to create the crappy campaigns they role out. PR agencies don't track results because then that would show that they have been a waste of money. Press releases with names of who is the new president, or a new certification course, or who now gets to work for Wool Safe, yeah ... that's really going to interest consumers. No ... it's going to feed some fat egos and spend those millions coming in from cleaners for their course certifications, expanding fees, and whatever else they can come up with to charge you for.

There have been some good changes on the IICRC board this past quarter - and I am optimistic about their path from a certified firm standpoint ... but I gave up on their marketing ability ages ago. The past marketing director stunk ... and the new president needs to get someone who has actually successfully marketing ANY type of business in that role. I'm sure there are many other choices besides someone who is not in the cleaning business at all and is a hold-over from the old regime.

So here's a free piece of marketing advice for you ... pull all of your off-line efforts off the table ... concentrate on-line since 75% of consumers look for service businesses on-line ... and take those extra hundreds of thousands of dollars and offer scholarships to cleaners to get more training - the more cleaners you have touting the IICRC locally and explaining the benefits of that to the consumers, to educate them.

There is not a single homeowner in my city who would be able to tell me IICRC exists, except cleaners I run into. So the ones who are seeking out the information ... and seeking it on-line - that's where to start.

Television ads will make a marketing report look good to the board and puff the director's feathers ... but it will be a complete waste of money in this case. Give an exam fee rebate back to cleaners instead - or a voucher toward a course.

You know what ... that's a great idea ... why not reward those who've been certified for a long time, who have spent thousands on courses, fees, CEC, and advertising IICRC on their own locally - and give them a customer appreciation gift of a voucher, thanking them for allowing the infrastructure of millions that has created financial support and opportunities for some - and then give all of the volunteers who've never gotten a dime vouchers too, since they are the biggest supporters and course attenders out there.

What do you think? :)
Lisa Wagner


What DO you think Lee?

Is she implying that you do not run a cleaning company?
To me it sounds like she wants your job.
 
G

Guest

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first things first ive called the iicrc numerous times to ask what how the fees they were collecting where working for me like the 30 dollars a year for your cert,and the 125 for certified frim and the lady couldnt tell me she was clue less. then one year i missed paying for certified firm status so it was near the end of the year i had the money i called them and the lady said it was december she said if i paid it would be allright but in two months i would have to pay the 125 all over again and i said WHAT she said cause i missed something about missing the previos year i said no thanks. the i ask her i was certified firm for 5 years i recieved 1 job for 65 dollars why didnt i have any calls and she said they were having problems with the referral program and i told her i was really getting any thing for the 625.00 dollars i had paid for the past years. and i had notice tha i had seen stanley steemer was always on top of the list. i think the girls that are tere were clueless she could answer any of my questions i was and still am disatisified with the iicrc.
 

Jim Martin

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What DO you think Lee?

Is she implying that you do not run a cleaning company?
To me it sounds like she wants your job.

She is no threat.....she rides on the shoulders of others......her long winded conflicting post has a captured audience of 5 ....and 3 of them are clapping because they are just confused....she should of stuck to just cleaning rugs.....
 

Mikey P

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The more I think about it the more I like the idea of a Angie's List deal.


Lee says they have $240K to spend this year in promotion.

That wont do squat in any other media.


Create a site, pay to have it in the non organic section through out the country on Yahoo and Google.

Have the code of ethics that we are suppose to abide by in full view.
Give company specifics such as how many trucks, how many (and what techs) are certified and in what services.
And a direct link to their sites if they have one or a phone number if they dont.

And a review section.

To post a review the customer will need to post a invoice number for the services rendered.
if it is a negative review it goes to Jim Pemberton's desk so he can call the customer and make sure her claims are legit. Jim can then call the company and give them a chance to make things right or the review gets posted.

3 strikes and you're out!


After a certain amount of time the company can be reviewed for reinstatement by Jim.
 
F

FB7777

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wouldn't an Angie's List format be susceptible to sabotage?

I've heard rumors of cleaners abusing Servicemagic to create phony leads for cleaners

the 3 strikes rule may seem fair for the little guy, but what if you're cranking out 5000 jobs a year?
 

Mikey P

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Fred Boyle said:
wouldn't an Angie's List format be susceptible to sabotage?

I've heard rumors of cleaners abusing Servicemagic to create phony leads for cleaners

the 3 strikes rule may seem fair for the little guy, but what if you're cranking out 5000 jobs a year?


3 strikes per tech?
 

-JB-

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Are you people entrepenurial business owners or union democrats~ I can't frickin believe this crap.
:shock:


PS. Ken you know the answer to that.
 

Ron Werner

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So here's a free piece of marketing advice for you ... pull all of your off-line efforts off the table ... concentrate on-line since 75% of consumers look for service businesses on-line ... and take those extra hundreds of thousands of dollars and offer scholarships to cleaners to get more training - the more cleaners you have touting the IICRC locally and explaining the benefits of that to the consumers, to educate them.

There is not a single homeowner in my city who would be able to tell me IICRC exists, except cleaners I run into. So the ones who are seeking out the information ... and seeking it on-line - that's where to start.

Lisa Wagner

I would add to this that not even all the cleaners you meet would be able to tell you who the IICRC is.
There's a cleaner here thats been working for the past 20 someodd yrs, I know he's never taken a course. His cleaning is proof of that.
Another cleaner "chose" to take a local college weekend course, meant for commercial maintenance.

Lisa makes some good points about marketing. If an ad isn't tracked, there is no way to determine its effectiveness. How many times have we critiqued an ad here on MB, how often does the ad just feed our own ego, ie looks great to me but to the consumer it means dick.

Maybe if the IICRC is willing, they can post their next ad on here for a critique.
 

LeeZ

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To answer you Mike, yes I have a cleaning company and a truck mount. My website is keystonecleangsevices.com if you choose to verify it. I have reduce my on truck time but still go out. I do not believe in person attacks, so you will not hear one from me. If I truly did not want to improve marketing, I would not have come to you all! I have seen many very good ideas presented here that I will take to our PR firm and to our marketing committee.
I also have seen many comments that are off topic, but are legitimate concerns. I will make sure that the committees that they do concern will get the information.
I started this with the thought that I would not try to justify what IICRC has done in the past, but to look to the future to correct what has been done. If I try to justify anything we will just get into a major debate, not that I don't enjoy a good debate! That is not want I want to accomplish here.
I can tell you though that all my customers know who IICRC is because I tell them. I educate my customers on the importance of my training. I am very proud of the work that I have put into my education.
I spoke with Tom Hill today about the problem Mr. Segreti had when he called in to the IICRC Headquarters. He is out of town right now( running a cancer marathon with Barry Costa), but he ask me to tell him that he would be calling him as soon as he gets back to his office.
 

Scott

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LeeZ said:
To answer you Mike, yes I have a cleaning company and a truck mount. My website is keystonecleangsevices.com if you choose to verify it. I have reduce my on truck time but still go out. I do not believe in person attacks, so you will not hear one from me. If I truly did not want to improve marketing, I would not have come to you all! I have seen many very good ideas presented here that I will take to our PR firm and to our marketing committee.
I also have seen many comments that are off topic, but are legitimate concerns. I will make sure that the committees that they do concern will get the information.
I started this with the thought that I would not try to justify what IICRC has done in the past, but to look to the future to correct what has been done. If I try to justify anything we will just get into a major debate, not that I don't enjoy a good debate! That is not want I want to accomplish here.
I can tell you though that all my customers know who IICRC is because I tell them. I educate my customers on the importance of my training. I am very proud of the work that I have put into my education.
I spoke with Tom Hill today about the problem Mr. Segreti had when he called in to the IICRC Headquarters. He is out of town right now( running a cancer marathon with Barry Costa), but he ask me to tell him that he would be calling him as soon as he gets back to his office.

Rock on, Lee! I'm so glad you're here.
 

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