hogjowl
Idiot™
2 inch vacuum hose is SO 1990's :shock: !
If you believe that HWE is NOT STEAM CLEANING...
- Thread starter Jimbo
- Start date
Bob Savage
Member
Shawn,
After reading all these posts from start to finish, I realized that your hypothetical, 2 carpet cleaning companies debate, are straight-out making the same dollars respectively each and every day of your scenario, the same type jobs every day for a year.
That ain't gonna' EVER happen!
No way, no how.
Some weeks are better than others, people get sick, go on vacation, get injuried, and sometimes can't work at all for various reasons; or, employees quit, get fired, take off work, production wains, mailers didn't get out on time -the list can go on forever.
So, you can't debate a situation (the Billy Bob/Scooter comparison) that is very UNLIKELY to occur with those exact dollars, the same every day, in your chart (as your calculations ARE based on the average per day, over a year).
Again, that situation does not account for the daily ins-and-outs of running a business.
Single owners are different - some are driven, some aren't. That is a major consideration in any comparison.
Ken Snow appears to have a top notch operation, but he has done it without the V/AT. Many other large scale operations are the same as Ken's, except for Venturi franchise, which wasn't very pretty. Venturi took the BIG truck route as a franshise, and it didn't work.
Nothing against the V/AT, but it seems to me that they are more geared for the O/O with a helper, but not for a large scale operation, or a franchise.
The debate with Larry was flawed from the beginning because of the numbers.
After reading all these posts from start to finish, I realized that your hypothetical, 2 carpet cleaning companies debate, are straight-out making the same dollars respectively each and every day of your scenario, the same type jobs every day for a year.
That ain't gonna' EVER happen!
No way, no how.
Some weeks are better than others, people get sick, go on vacation, get injuried, and sometimes can't work at all for various reasons; or, employees quit, get fired, take off work, production wains, mailers didn't get out on time -the list can go on forever.
So, you can't debate a situation (the Billy Bob/Scooter comparison) that is very UNLIKELY to occur with those exact dollars, the same every day, in your chart (as your calculations ARE based on the average per day, over a year).
Again, that situation does not account for the daily ins-and-outs of running a business.
Single owners are different - some are driven, some aren't. That is a major consideration in any comparison.
Ken Snow appears to have a top notch operation, but he has done it without the V/AT. Many other large scale operations are the same as Ken's, except for Venturi franchise, which wasn't very pretty. Venturi took the BIG truck route as a franshise, and it didn't work.
Nothing against the V/AT, but it seems to me that they are more geared for the O/O with a helper, but not for a large scale operation, or a franchise.
The debate with Larry was flawed from the beginning because of the numbers.
steve frasier
Supportive Member
york said:
How much is Billy's buyout at the end of the lease?
york said:
I had a 56 blower on my Thermal Wave II, I think it ran about 2300 rpm @ 15" of lift and if I ran it to 17" it would bog down a little
my Vortex runs a #7 blower @ something like 69% @ 17" of lift @ 1700 rpm and usually run it at 1400/1500 single wand and it hits 15" of lift but could easily increase the lift to 19" @1700 rpm and really have no problem. I think 19" @ 1700 rpm would suck the dome lid gasket right out of it :shock:
other then the diesel having more tourque at a lower rpm I would think all things would be the same
but I am curious, when you step up in blower size how does it really compare. Is it like decibles or a PH scale were with each step up can be a 10 fold increase.
Without the torque the high lift would be useless.
Dolly Llama
Number 5
Shawn York said:
no, i didn't say that Shawn.
What I ASKED was, what's the "Practical" difference between 2350 RPM and 2400 RPM (the 50rpm YOU noted) on a 59 blower sucking thru 100ft of 2" vac hose and typical 2" tubed wand.
You made it sound like there's a BIG difference.
Should just be a matter math, No?
Given that only so much air can be pulled thru a straw at 15hg, no?
THAT'S what I'm "saying"
..L.T.A.
Lee Stockwell
FOJL
Just saw Diesel drop to $3.87 in Benton KY, only 20 cents over regular gas. Not feeling so bad about buying the diesel van now.
On topic now, the diesel just won't bog down no matter what. Of course it's a 7.3 Powerstroke, not one of those whimpy box truck motors....
On topic now, the diesel just won't bog down no matter what. Of course it's a 7.3 Powerstroke, not one of those whimpy box truck motors....
Dolly Llama
Number 5
Shawn York said:
I can work with that.
What HP is the UD motor?
115 hp?
Now how many ponies are lost driving the PTO?
10? 20? 30?
make it 30 if that's on the high side.
so, for a "similar' gas engine, we're at 70+ hp minimum.
Shawn York said:
not if we're comparing "similar" HP engines in the 70+ HP range
[/quote]
Shawn York said:
logic and good reasoning would suggest to me the diesel would be a better motor just cause it has over capacity and the gas engine is on the edge of it's limitations (at any kind of serious HG)
This part is what I'm trying to find out;
"perform equally on CFM and vacuum"
Cause I don't know about the CFM.
The "vac" part should remain the same regardless.
A positive displacement blower will create 15hg at 1400 rpm or 2400rpm.
It's the CFMs that differ with RPM
Thus my "straw" thingie you say you don't know what I'm talking about.
I'll try and clarify.
you can only pull a finite number of CFMs thru 100ft of hose and wand at 15HG.
I don't know what the number is.
maybe one of the math wizards can calculate it
lets just say it's 300CFM for argument's sake.
if a 59 blower develops 300cfm @15hg at 2000rpm, it won't matter if the blower is spinning at 2000 or 2400.
it's maxed at howmany CFM will flow thru a straw
see what I'm saying?
..L.T.A.
Oh my God! It is f'n comical to read some of these comments. NONE OF YOU CLEAN WITH STEAM. NONE OF YOU. If you are attempting to do that you are wasting a lot of time. REAL steam would not provide enough flow to clean a carpet well.
What is wrong with you guys? God. It is ridiculous to read what so called good cleaners are yapping about.
I remember when the Powermatic crew came to town. We cleaned a commercial carpet with the 2100 and got good results cleaning extremely hot.
We then cleaned a area right next to that area with a Crossfire 4.4 with water that was barely 200 ATM. The results were the same.
It is sad to see the direction this industry is taking. Instead of cleaners learning to clean....we have guys that only think the equipment is important.
Just pathetic.
DevilDog
P.S.-Hey you heat loving whores...you are not cleaning with real steam...if you are...you are leaving a lot of soil in the carpet because steam will not flush.
What is wrong with you guys? God. It is ridiculous to read what so called good cleaners are yapping about.
I remember when the Powermatic crew came to town. We cleaned a commercial carpet with the 2100 and got good results cleaning extremely hot.
We then cleaned a area right next to that area with a Crossfire 4.4 with water that was barely 200 ATM. The results were the same.
It is sad to see the direction this industry is taking. Instead of cleaners learning to clean....we have guys that only think the equipment is important.
Just pathetic.
DevilDog
P.S.-Hey you heat loving whores...you are not cleaning with real steam...if you are...you are leaving a lot of soil in the carpet because steam will not flush.
Mikey P
Administrator
You're gonna die of a heart attack.
Brian R
Member
What Devildog said.
Mike Draper
Member
- Joined
- Jan 13, 2008
- Messages
- 4,402
Sorry, I've been cleaning everything for the last 1.5 years at 185-200. Now I run about 245 at the wand and it cleans better. No way around it, just a fact!!
Mikeyxj8 said:
How did you get the extra heat?
Same TM?
You probably posted it before but i'm not going back is this thread to find it.
Heat is the next thing I want to work on, my 2.5 should be here tomorrow. Right now just hose in different area codes. (I know that was bad,couldn't resist)
Keith
Mike Draper
Member
- Joined
- Jan 13, 2008
- Messages
- 4,402
I replaced the muffler under my van with an exhaust HX. See more in High performance room. I believe it's under topic " my new HX I built" or something like that.
Dolly Llama
Number 5
Mikeyxj8 said:
no need to argue with Pound PuPpiE.
He knows everything, or he know LOTS of people who know everything and gets e-mails :roll:
What I've observed is, there's little to no difference in cleaning efficacy going from 250 to 280.
However, there is a very noticeable difference going from 200 to 240
Todd wants me to turn down the heat so I'll have to use more butyl and DIE sooner.....
..L.T.A.
captaincarpet
Member
Actually the UD has a 175 Hp motor. I was told at AT that the PTO used 40+ hp if my memory serves...
This has been a GREAT thread!
LMAO
This has been a GREAT thread!
LMAO
G
Guest
Guest
I agree with Larry; 240 to 300 pressure washing was awesome; but c/c; anything past 240 i really start watching fibers!!! I know I hate doing dog apartments with propane!!!
Jimbo
Member
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2006
- Messages
- 2,197
Any new Ideas or viewpoints that you would like to add to this thread??
Where is the best place to get a UD truck worked on?
How much is a typical engine rebuild?
How about a transmission rebuild?
Where is the best place to get a UD truck worked on?
How much is a typical engine rebuild?
How about a transmission rebuild?
Mikey P
Administrator
My local (and only) diesel mechanics hate the UD.
Jack Zipper Zerkie
Member
For the answer to the steam question check with your local Hotsy dealer. I was told that water steams at 325 and boils at 212, but any hot water is dangerous. Here in florida water over 212 in the summer and high humidity makes carpet cleaning different especially with out power in the house or ceiling fans for drying and global warming. jack z.
GeneMiller
Member
Performance chemical had the vortex for a couple weeks when they were traveling through and he tried to sell it to me. I cleaned side by side and it didn't clean any better or any faster then I did. I cleaned at my normal rate and he cleaned his way. I stood on a paper towel for 10 seconds after on each carpet in random areas picked by bystanders and their was no noticeable difference. They were running 2.5 and I was running straight 2 at the time. The machine can only run as fast as the operator pulls the wands. We did not run a dual wand test. Depending on what you are used to you may actually clean slower with the vortex, Arm fatigue
Shawn I don't think it matters which engine as long as it doesn't bog. the correct engine for the size of the blower is what matters. I have the link and my engine maintains the exact same rpms even if I fully block the hose and relief.
The diesels advantage is it can turn slower and product more torx which is a good thing because they are loud as hell, to quote Jim they sound like a cement mixer getting ready to throw a bearing.
Gene
Shawn I don't think it matters which engine as long as it doesn't bog. the correct engine for the size of the blower is what matters. I have the link and my engine maintains the exact same rpms even if I fully block the hose and relief.
The diesels advantage is it can turn slower and product more torx which is a good thing because they are loud as hell, to quote Jim they sound like a cement mixer getting ready to throw a bearing.
Gene
ACE
Member
I should have my Powermatic running by the end of the year so; I’ll be enjoying so real hot temps for once. I don’t think I’ll crank it up over 230 much unless I’m cleaning some grease pit. Temps over 230 don’t add much to the finished result and burn out hoses, connections and cause burns fast.
What kind of hose are those of you that run over 250 most of the time using, and how long does it last?
What kind of hose are those of you that run over 250 most of the time using, and how long does it last?
GeneMiller
Member
When I went to the box I went from the 100 to a 200 gal tank and an electric reel. I love the electric reel , what an arm and time saver. I wish it had a remote and I could reverse it for setting up. What was this thread about ?
Gene
Gene
Mountain View Carpet Care
Member
- Joined
- Apr 4, 2007
- Messages
- 1,085
DevilDog said:
I was just going to say the same thing but you beat me to it, Nylon 6,6 has a melting point of 256°C 492.8 ºF
everfresh1
Member
220 to 240 is the best temp to clean with, anything over that is to hot. Oil fired units are the hottest the more you squeeze that trigger the hotter they get.
Jimbo
Member
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2006
- Messages
- 2,197
Are there other threads with this many views??
Just curious!
Just curious!
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
I think there was one about a guy who sold another guy a machine with a bent handle, that had a lot of views and posts.
that thread was just drama not much valuable info in there.
i am going to call you tomorrow want to take some time to check out the pics you sent me.I
that thread was just drama not much valuable info in there.
i am going to call you tomorrow want to take some time to check out the pics you sent me.I
juniorc82
Supportive Member
bob an electric machine didnt reach that temp, a fuel fired heater did
