Rotary Extraction shoot out at M9F results.

[Mardie]

The cleaning head is spinning furiously and the jets are going just as fast; it's an amazing sight, the swoop heads are pushing and scrubbing the fibers' the jets do an excellent job hitting the entire fiber. The extraction is excellent either with my 500 CFM TM or my 230 CFM porty. The machine will scoot across a carpet as fast as you can move on a not too dirty job but of course you have to go slow where needed.I can go over a room in a minute or two just like with a wand.
I

Art it is good to hear that you can scoot along on the cleaner carpet and that you can go over a room as fast as a wand if the conditions permit.Since i have been on this board i always got the impression that rotaries were very slow and cumberson.I realy liked that they were much more thorough than a wand but always hesitated because of the fact that i thought they were so slow.

Thanks for the insite

 

[Aaabrightfloor]

I was ready to buy a T REX for my LTD 15 last week now I am second guessing that idea

Will a HOSS work with a portable with a vacuum booster?
LTD15 with two 3 stage vac and a vacuum booster with two 3 stage vacuums (parallel)

 

[Jim Martin]

I was ready to buy a T REX for my LTD 15 last week now I am second guessing that idea

Will a HOSS work with a portable with a vacuum booster?
LTD15 with two 3 stage vac and a vacuum booster with two 3 stage vacuums (parallel)

no.....way to much machine for that set up....as much as I like the Hoss....it would not be a good fit....your better off with the 360i...

 

[Art Kelley]

Well a wand is always going to be faster than a rotary Mardie but you can swing or shoot across a room pretty fast with the 360i. I think the main reason I put away my RX20 (the old style slow speed one) was that it was sooo slow moving and you had to just plod along unti you were done. The high speed one presumably addressed that issue.

 

[floorguy]

like Jimbo cares...he flat out STOLE that thing....he can drop a few bucks on it and still be way ahead...

there is a way for the 360 to be fixed.....

i am torn between the 2 really....360 for the weight of moving it around....but the hoss looked like it would plain clean some carpet....

I am wondering about the commercial comments though...that put a damper on it....360 no way on commercial...

 

[floorguy]

oh also as far as rotary vs wand....


after 3-4 jobs a day...you will be faster with the rotary and do a MUCH better job....it doesnt get tired like a man does

 

[Art Kelley]

I was ready to buy a T REX for my LTD 15 last week now I am second guessing that idea

Will a HOSS work with a portable with a vacuum booster?
LTD15 with two 3 stage vac and a vacuum booster with two 3 stage vacuums (parallel)

That set up (with over 300 CFM) should be more than sufficient for the Hoss. Larry Cobb should be able to answer that though without guessing.

 

[Mardie]

Well a wand is always going to be faster than a rotary Mardie but you can swing or shoot across a room pretty fast with the 360i. I think the main reason I put away my RX20 (the old style slow speed one) was that it was sooo slow moving and you had to just plod along unti you were done. The high speed one presumably addressed that issue.

Ya i understand what you are saying. I thought it was so slow that the only time people used it was for the real nasties.

 

[Jim Martin]

That set up (with over 300 CFM) should be more than sufficient for the Hoss. Larry Cobb should be able to answer that though without guessing.

stands to much of a chance of over wetting........biggest problem...most just can't quite grasp the difference between the jets and flow/flush bars....that is where the hoss will out shine them all....

 

[Art Kelley]

oh also as far as rotary vs wand....


after 3-4 jobs a day...you will be faster with the rotary and do a MUCH better job....it doesnt get tired like a man does

That's so true. I used to dread that 4PM big job after working eight hours, but with the 360i I just do it like any other. Plus using it has cured a multi-year shoulder injury. I'm just not 22 anymore.

 

[floorguy]

That's so true. I used to dread that 4PM big job after working eight hours, but with the 360i I just do it like any other. Plus using it has cured a multi-year shoulder injury. I'm just not 22 anymore.

yup i got a shoulder injury to, that is slowly healing...there are still some jobs i just wand out though....

 

[Aaabrightfloor]

no.....way to much machine for that set up....as much as I like the Hoss....it would not be a good fit....your better off with the 360i...

That make me feel very stupid I listen to a guy on the other forum (Deron)
And I sold my 360i to buy a T REX stupid me

 

[Jim Martin]

That make me feel very stupid I listen to a guy on the other forum (Deron)
And I sold my 360i to buy a T REX stupid me

sorry to hear that...I know Art is just as passionate about his 360i as I am with my Hoss...but no one here would ever turn you the wrong way no matter how we feel about our machines...

 

[Mardie]

I have been watching these rotaries for a while now and i find that when you hear comments on things it sure helps to know were they are coming from.
The only person that had anything to say about which rotary cleaned the best and had the best dry times was John Olson and from what John said is that the T-Rex is by far the best at that.
I have good faith in Johns opinion.I have no doubt that the T-Rex will come out of this show down smelling like a rose.
Lucky for me i got lots of time to make a decision but i think for know i will just keep my ears open.
It aint over till the fat lady sings.

 

[Larry Cobb]

Fred;

John is making the better vac seal gasket available from Mytee for everybody who has purchased a TRex !!

Larry

P.S. We are still making the jet mods to all the Bentleys for our customers.

 

[Larry Cobb]

That set up (with over 300 CFM) should be more than sufficient for the Hoss. Larry Cobb should be able to answer that though without guessing.

Aaabrightfloor;

Your Quad vac machine can easily handle a 15' Hoss rotary extractor.

These guys have never run a portable like that.

Larry

 

[Larry Cobb]

......the problem with both the.T-Rex and the 360 is called...MOTOR DRAG...

they HAVE to have a start capacitor for the start up of the head.....you have to have...full load to the windings to start the rotation....then it will drop to running amps...once and only once the rotation starts......If you start looking into motors that will actually work for what you are doing...you will lose the torque that is causing these machines to bog down and twist the way that they are.......and relieve the stress that is being put on them.......

You guys get so damn defensive over your machines and refuse to listen to anyone and just keep shooting yourself in the foot.......Get away from those stupid...F%$Ked...up variable speed motors......they have no place in this industry.......Put something on there that has the balls to work against the vacuum on the truckmounts....raise the things up so the jets can do there job and you just might have something that will be competitive.........

Jim;

The long frame DC motor on the TRex has plenty of power to spin the head on any carpet.

This TRex speed control has adjustable settings for maximum torque.

This setting can be easily changed for more torque.

It is NOT that the large motor doesn't have enough torque.

Larry

P.S. We had to adjust the torque setting on the RV360i when we got the 1st RV carpet cleaning brush head also.

 

[Goomer]

I would think that a T-Rex bound for an unveiling as such would have all the necessary upgrades (Gasket) and adjustments (Torque) to perform in front of such a crowd.
Was anyone present from Mytee to address these issues....tweak if necessary...or explain the issues??

 

[Goomer]

I was ready to buy a T REX for my LTD 15 last week now I am second guessing that idea

Will a HOSS work with a portable with a vacuum booster?
LTD15 with two 3 stage vac and a vacuum booster with two 3 stage vacuums (parallel)

No concerns regarding amp requirements?
I'd be blowin breakers all day.

 

[SamIam]

John was there, and Mike kept asking whats up, I didn't rate any of them I was only able to try the hoss and the rx20, so I felt like my opinion would be skewed, It was so busy with all the classes, I should have made myself try them all.

I would say with all the votes it seems pretty accurate

And darn I would tried to out bid Jimbo on that hoss lucky!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[Mikey P]

The long frame DC motor on the TRex has plenty of power to spin the head on any carpet.-Really Larry? have you cleaned anything with it other than that flay CGD in your shop?


This TRex speed control has adjustable settings for maximum torque.- I disagree, the thing was stalling at high speed, low speed, thick, thin and otherwise? Were these faulty units brought to MF?
This setting can be easily changed for more torque.-How?

It is NOT that the large motor doesn't have enough torque.-Come on Larry, are you calling MF attendees liars? Did Bruders pay us all off with doughnuts and Quiznos?

 

[Mikey P]

I would think that a T-Rex bound for an unveiling as such would have all the necessary upgrades (Gasket) and adjustments (Torque) to perform in front of such a crowd.
Was anyone present from Mytee to address these issues....tweak if necessary...or explain the issues??

A vendor close by counted John and Nathan wrenching on the units more than 7 times.


I'll say it again, The Trex is NOT READY FOR PRODUCTION and any of you would be a fool to buy one right now.


it always amazes me what some of you will say in private but don't have the balls to say in print.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

The very earliest RX-20's also had issues. However in that pre Internet era we had nothing like MB to sort them out.

 

[Larry Cobb]

The long frame DC motor on the TRex has plenty of power to spin the head on any carpet.-Really Larry? have you cleaned anything with it other than that flay CGD in your shop?


This TRex speed control has adjustable settings for maximum torque.- I disagree, the thing was stalling at high speed, low speed, thick, thin and otherwise? Were these faulty units brought to MF?
This setting can be easily changed for more torque.-How?

It is NOT that the large motor doesn't have enough torque.-Come on Larry, are you calling MF attendees liars? Did Bruders pay us all off with doughnuts and Quiznos?

Mikey;

The Hoss is a 1/2 HP motor.

The TRex is a 1/2 HP motor with a longer frame design.

This should actually produce more torque.

Both machines should have more than enough torque for even the heaviest carpet pile.

The speed control is limiting the torque available.

John should have a photo of the speed control.

Larry

 

[SamIam]

All I can say was the Quiznos and doughnuts were tasty, Doah!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[Mikey P]

The Hoss is a 1/2 HP motor.

The TRex is a 1/2 HP motor with a longer frame design.

This should actually produce more torque.

but the HOSS does not have 6 long and knurled vacuum ports to cause all that friction.


Larry how do you explain what was happening at MF? Even when I adjusted the speed, most of the time the power would stop start and then start back up.


Why would they bring a unit, actually two units, with these issues to an event where John was convinced EVERYONE would be blown away?

Why did they pick the thinnest carpet to run the demo on?


Something is not right here..

 

[Mikey P]

John and Larry have given us every reason in the world why this motor SHOULD be better than the competition but the fact is, unless those two units were fluke lemons, the motor chosen is not even close to being up to the job.

I will not handle the abuse that a carpet scrubbing machine gets from technicians and careless operators.




and lets not forget the plastic construction that WILL FAIL very quickly.



Larry, have you used this machine on medium to high grade nylon pile carpet? How many square feet did you clean? What sort of extractor was used?

 

[Bill Bruders]

Mikey;

The Hoss is a 1/2 HP motor.

The TRex is a 1/2 HP motor with a longer frame design.

This should actually produce more torque.

Both machines should have more than enough torque for even the heaviest carpet pile.

The speed control is limiting the torque available.

John should have a photo of the speed control.

Larry

Larry
I don't know the source of your motor info is but a longer frame design doesn't equate to torque anymore than a pure horsepower rating does.
Any unit in this "category" needs proper engineering to work effectively in the various applications that it will be subjected to.
You just can't cut costs and expect results every cleaner knows that. Think about truckmounts for the most part the price of every top line manufacturer unit is very close when engine size, blower etc are compared.
I suspect I'll get slammed for saying this but when your goal is to build a cheaper product the results are normally just that cheaper rarely are they better.

 

[Larry Cobb]

Bill;

To quote from Reliance Motor white paper (who makes both AC and DC Motors):

Power and Torque Density

Based on historical usage of modem AC and DC machines in industrial applications,
the DC motor would appear to have a distinct advantage in terms of either power developed per frame size, or torque per frame size.
The comparisons of power density in Figure 15 are based on typical catalog offerings of open, self-ventilated AC and DC motors in NEMA frame sizes. There are some issues which make "typical catalog offerings" of these motors less than a perfect "apples-to-apples" comparison. The AC motors tend to be built in frame sizes as established by NEMA MG 13. These motors/ratings are based on Class B insulation, 1. 15 Service Factor, and operation on sodial power (not inverter power). The DC motors/ratings tend to follow a pattern of Class F insulation, 1.0 Service Factor, and rated for operation on static (rectified) power supplies.

Larger frame sizes allow greater torque.

Graph of AC vs. DC Torque:

http://www.plantservices.com/Media/1002/Article_DCMotor1HR.jpg

Larry

 

[Mikey P]

Sweet baby Jesus Larry, answer my damn question...

Have you actually used the trex on any thing but your shop carpet?