BlueLine Thermalwave2 summer/fall project

[BIG WOOD]

I’m taking it to the forklift later this week to move it. Rubber mats underneath are getting pulled up.

The waste tank was behind it but I think I’m gonna move it to the left side of the machine for better mounting space and ease of access to the rear and right side of the machine.

The van needs a power steering fluid reservoir, a tuneup, and a new rear door

As for the tm, the water pump needs tlc, and the 185f thermal relief valve needs replaced. . Once I get it completed, we’ll see what other issues it might have

 

[FredC]

I need to do a test just to see if gas comes out of that vac line while it runs to see if that’s why the pressure is low

Which vac line?

I thought he was talking about the one you would see on an FPR

 

[BIG WOOD]

Which vac line?

I thought he was talking about the one you would see on an FPR
View attachment 120862

Maybe I misunderstood. I was thinking about the fuel line that returns fuel back to the tank

 

[FredC]

Maybe I misunderstood. I was thinking about the fuel line that returns fuel back to the tank

I guess it could be bleeding off too much...

Do you have an actual manual?

If you talk to somebody at PSI that sounds like they know what they are talking about ask them which method is used to calculate the fuel pressure. It may not be gauge pressure and could make that 32 or whatever what you should actually be seeing on the gauge.

 

[FredC]

It's possible it could be bleeding off too much. Especially since it is the only thing separating the two sides with the only other leakdown point being the injectors. I ended up finding that 55 number which got me thinking about why would it be bleeding off too much.

When the manual tells you to put a gauge inline it doesn't say where. If we assume before the manifold is where you should see the 55 +/- 5 I suppose your reading of 70+ could be overpowering the check valve in the bleed circuit. Are you using the correct pump?



do you have a model-specific manual?

 

[Living The Dream]

It's possible it could be bleeding off too much. Especially since it is the only thing separating the two sides with the only other leakdown point being the injectors. I ended up finding that 55 number which got me thinking about why would it be bleeding off too much.

When the manual tells you to put a gauge inline it doesn't say where. If we assume before the manifold is where you should see the 55 +/- 5 I suppose your reading of 70+ could be overpowering the check valve in the bleed circuit. Are you using the correct pump?

View attachment 120863

do you have a model-specific manual?

I was thinking pump also.

 

[FredC]

Yeah but think my line of thinking is incorrect because I would assume the circuit is designed to work at a constant rate so the only thing increasing the pressure would do is increase the volume going back to the tank. The check valve existing to close when the pressure drops so that fuel/air isn't pulled back in.

not opening up more with pressure increase as I was thinking


so I still don't fn know



Matt how were the spring and ball oriented in that thing?

 

[Living The Dream]

Maybe I misunderstood. I was thinking about the fuel line that returns fuel back to the tank

This is what I was referring to if fast forward to 2:10.

 

[FredC]

This is what I was referring to if fast forward to 2:10.

Yep. There isn't one on this system.

 

[Living The Dream]

Yeah but I'm not sure my line of thinking is correct because I would assume the circuit is designed to work at a constant rate so the only thing increasing the pressure would do is increase the volume going back to the tank. The check valve existing to close when the pressure drops so that fuel/air isn't pulled back in.

not opening up more with pressure increase


so I still don't fn know

I'm curious to know which fuel pump he's running and also what rate or GPM the pump is rated for. It's possibly underrated?

 

[Nate The Great]

I'm pretty sure if you ball valve the return line and put a bit of restriction on it, it should boost the head pressure.. I'm no mechanic though.. I know that's a redneck trick but none the less..

 

[FredC]

I'm pretty sure if you ball valve the return line and put a bit of restriction on it, it should boost the head pressure.. I'm no mechanic though.. I know that's a redneck trick but none the less..

Maybe.

but this isn't a traditional return line. It's a jet/orifice that sprays a small amount into the "return line"

 

[Nate The Great]

Maybe.

but this isn't a traditional return line. It's a jet/orifice that sprays a small amount into the "return line"

Well ain't that a b!tch.. Does Justin from Legends not pop in here anymore? Did Matty run him off?

 

[FredC]

Well ain't that a b!tch.. Does Justin from Legends not pop in here anymore? Did Matty run him off?

He was here yesterday but hasn't posted in a while. I think he gave up on Matt last year.

Probably him constantly bashing suppliers/manufacturers/techs

but Marty is always a good guess

 

[Nate The Great]

I'm not surprised.. J dawg was always willing to help if he could.. I get that machine break down isn't fun and very stressful.. I always play devil's advocate with all matters.. But bashing suppliers/manufactures /techs will limit even the potential person who does know what is going on.. My .02 cents.. Hope you figure it out Matty!

 

[BIG WOOD]

Fred, that's the exact fuel pump I use. It's rated at 95psi, and sapphire told me they use a 120psi pump. I bought one of those on their specs and it didn't give any improvement. So I put that 95 back on since it looks more original

That ball in spring valve is deep inside the bleed port that goes back to the fuel tank. I'll post a pic of both the old and new one

And Nate, I tried clamping that bleed hose to see if it'd increase the fuel pressure, and all it did was prevent my machine from starting up. So that's a dead end.

It's possible it could be bleeding off too much. Especially since it is the only thing separating the two sides with the only other leakdown point being the injectors. I ended up finding that 55 number which got me thinking about why would it be bleeding off too much.

When the manual tells you to put a gauge inline it doesn't say where. If we assume before the manifold is where you should see the 55 +/- 5 I suppose your reading of 70+ could be overpowering the check valve in the bleed circuit. Are you using the correct pump?

View attachment 120863

do you have a model-specific manual?

And look how the fuel goes into the MAP sensor manifold. Sapphire flipped that thing backwards and the fuel enters the manifold from the other end. I tried flipping it on the old manifold, but not the new one yet. I never got an explanation on why they suggest that on the thermal wave.

 

[BIG WOOD]

Pics of inside manifold old and new

 

[FredC]

OK....I'm back to thinking maybe the pressure is correct at the rail...

can you make us a vid of all this and the unit running?

 

[BIG WOOD]

OK....I'm back to thinking maybe the pressure is correct at the rail...

can you make us a vid of all this and the unit running?

I haven’t tested the area yet but I think you were right on it being o2 sensor related. @Mike J told me to call Scott Lombardi (thanks Mike!) I spoke to Lombardi this morning and he targeted the area of concern from my description of the problem and code 91

I’ll let you know what I find when I get back on it

 

[Living The Dream]

Matt, does your machine have it's own gas tank or is it tapped into your van? Could venting be an issue?

 

[BIG WOOD]

Matt, does your machine have it's own gas tank or is it tapped into your van? Could venting be an issue?

It's properly tapped in the van. One of the first things I did was tear out the previous owner's homemade rigged up FKN fuel tap and install the proper one made for this van. I doubt venting is an issue.


The part I'll check on this weekend is the doughnut gasket under the exhaust header. I was told that is a troubled area and I remember the previous owner telling me he replaced it with a "matched" one he found at an auto parts store. FKIN BAndaided almost everything on thiS DAMN MACHINE! I hate cleaning up rigged shit! Why can't people just fKIN replace shit the right way, instead of duct taping!!!

Back to my problem...If it's still leaking, it's pulling in fresh, cool air, telling the O2 sensor it's rich in fuel, therefore the ECU tells the pump (code91) to lighten the fuel pressure so it burns leaner, which causes the problem I'm experiencing. That's what Scott Lombardi told me this morning, which made perfect sense. Especially since I know the history of the douchebag bandaid ing this part.

 

[Nate The Great]

If you spent any time at a distributors shop and seen others equipment, you'd understand that it's a normal occurrence. @Jim Pemberton can be witness to it.. I'm not casting any stones, I have rednecked a thing or three in my days.. You do what you need to do to finish the job.. But that fixing it later keeps getting put off until it can't..

Also, Slim @Jim Martin knows that machine like the back of his hand.. Sounds like you may be on the right track now..

 

[FredC]

It's properly tapped in the van. One of the first things I did was tear out the previous owner's homemade rigged up FKN fuel tap and install the proper one made for this van. I doubt venting is an issue.


The part I'll check on this weekend is the doughnut gasket under the exhaust header. I was told that is a troubled area and I remember the previous owner telling me he replaced it with a "matched" one he found at an auto parts store. FKIN BAndaided almost everything on thiS DAMN MACHINE! I hate cleaning up rigged shit! Why can't people just fKIN replace shit the right way, instead of duct taping!!!

Back to my problem...If it's still leaking, it's pulling in fresh, cool air, telling the O2 sensor it's rich in fuel, therefore the ECU tells the pump (code91) to lighten the fuel pressure so it burns leaner, which causes the problem I'm experiencing. That's what Scott Lombardi told me this morning, which made perfect sense. Especially since I know the history of the douchebag bandaid ing this part.

An exhaust leak would more likely create a false lean. The af sensor right after would be reading more air than it should be and therefore reporting to the ecu that the mixture should be richened.

But you are seeing signs of an actual lean condition

Of course it’s still not a bad idea to listen/check for leaks

And check/replace the upstream o2 sensor

 

[BIG WOOD]

An exhaust leak would more likely create a false lean. The af sensor right after would be reading more air than it should be and therefore reporting to the ecu that the mixture should be richened.

But you are seeing signs of an actual lean condition

Of course it’s still not a bad idea to listen/check for leaks

And check/replace the upstream o2 sensor

He made a point about the cool air being the culprit, saying that it reads too rich since it’s cooler, but I’m just repeating what I remember for our conversation. I’ll know more when I do some testing and checking codes after I swap out the doughnut gaskets

 

[Jim Pemberton]

If you spent any time at a distributors shop and seen others equipment, you'd understand that it's a normal occurrence. @Jim Pemberton can be witness to it.. I'm not casting any stones, I have rednecked a thing or three in my days.. You do what you need to do to finish the job.. But that fixing it later keeps getting put off until it can't..

Also, Slim @Jim Martin knows that machine like the back of his hand.. Sounds like you may be on the right track now..

I wouldn’t know where to begin....there are so many such stories

 

[Mikey P]

I think this thread has been a clever attempt to get me to sell you a TOPS at a discount.

 

[FredC]

He made a point about the cool air being the culprit, saying that it reads too rich since it’s cooler, but I’m just repeating what I remember for our conversation. I’ll know more when I do some testing and checking codes after I swap out the doughnut gaskets

I think you might be misremembering. An intake leak could certainly cause a lean condition.

Introducing air into the exhaust stream before the o2 sensor is more likely to make it appear to be lean when it’s not. Possibly even throwing a lean code but depending on the severity may just attempt to richen the mixture.

So you would see indications of a rich condition at the plugs while the o2 sensor was indicating lean


Barring some more serious issues the combustion chamber mix shouldn’t be directly affected by an exhaust leak


I suppose there is a chance this could somehow trigger the 91 but that seems more likely to be a wiring issue if not o2

 

[BIG WOOD]

Fixed the code 91 with replacing the donut. I'll post some pics and video soon

A new code came up. 134 EGO 1 open/inactive

 

[BIG WOOD]

From the code chart, I think that means a heated oxygen sensor from this exhaust leak. New ox sensors are now on the list

 

[BIG WOOD]

Cause of all this pipe overheating

The fuel pressure is still the same but the o2 sensors might still be the cause

 

[BIG WOOD]

I don’t know if this is normal looking. But the terminal for certain is damaged. It was wrapped with electrical tape