Desk Jockey
Member
Drinking! 
the power of the Cimex..
- Thread starter Mikey P
- Start date
Shane Deubell
Supportive Member
- Joined
- Jun 30, 2011
- Messages
- 4,052
Drinking!
Exactly, sugary drinks and alcohol will kill ya a whole lot quicker then pixie dust.
Could always buy one of these.
GreenTechAgain
Member
Rick, all told how much does it cost to get a product "DFE certified" and how long is the process?
Want accountability / Here it is...
The EPA has a program called DFE - Designed For the Environment. What does the EPA look for in their certification? Three things:
1. They look at each raw ingredient to make sure it's safe for the environment.
2. They look at how the raw ingredients interact with each other, to make sure it's safe for the environment.
3. They look at how the product is intended to be used to ascertain that it's safe for all concerned (environment, occupants, technicians).
Releasit Bio-Encap is DFE certified. It is SAFE for the environment.
http://releasit.com/green-encap-cleaning/green-encap-cleaning.html
Worried about Pixie dust coming up from the carpet?
The greatest air cleaner ever invented is carpet. Dust settles into it and immediately gravitates down into the backing. Never to come back up. Every time you step on the carpet you are helping the dirt that hasn't reached the bottom go a little deeper. It will be there until you take the carpet out.
Gravity an the porous nature of carpet are our friends. They do not allow dust to come back up once it goes into the carpet. One way dirt collector.
The greatest air cleaner ever invented is carpet. Dust settles into it and immediately gravitates down into the backing. Never to come back up. Every time you step on the carpet you are helping the dirt that hasn't reached the bottom go a little deeper. It will be there until you take the carpet out.
Gravity an the porous nature of carpet are our friends. They do not allow dust to come back up once it goes into the carpet. One way dirt collector.
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
Grass fed beef, organic fruits and vegetables( wife is prego and thinks that's all we should eat as it costs almost double what walmart costs), don't drink beer or Anykind of alcohol, don't smoke or vape.
Where safety equipment when needed and just try to take care of myself playing softball and soccer a couple of times a week and I could swear all of this organic food is making gain some weight.
Where safety equipment when needed and just try to take care of myself playing softball and soccer a couple of times a week and I could swear all of this organic food is making gain some weight.
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
Open the window or just watch in a commercial building as Sun Rays come through the window and try to tell me it just stays Down in the carpet.
Do the same while vacuuming and it will appear to be a dust storm all the while breathing in the "pixie" dust.
All I want is to be able to use the product in good conscience know the product has been tested and found not to be harmful or toxic, especially in the future.
Again asbestos was the economical solution that provided good results, and as for me this is a concern.
Do the same while vacuuming and it will appear to be a dust storm all the while breathing in the "pixie" dust.
All I want is to be able to use the product in good conscience know the product has been tested and found not to be harmful or toxic, especially in the future.
Again asbestos was the economical solution that provided good results, and as for me this is a concern.
Desk Jockey
Member
All hypothetical, admit it how much experience do you have using a Cimex and Encap cleaning. Nuff said!!!
I own your Cimex and it is VERY glad to be away from you and put to work...finally.
Last edited by a moderator:
my guess is, many thousands of $$$
i agree with Dealtime, y'all should stay away from Encap!
hacks!
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
I don't say stay away from encap I just want to know what the manufacturers have done as far as testing to protect us from future litigation.
That being said what makes one product safe, and the rest of the line not safe or certified, this all.
That being said what makes one product safe, and the rest of the line not safe or certified, this all.
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
Next time I am up there we will do some testing of our own to determine if this encap is what is causing all of delusional and frankly quite scary behavior.All hypothetical, admit it how much experience do you have using a Cimex and Encap cleaning. Nuff said!!!
I own your Cimex and it is VERY glad to be away from you and put to work...finally.
Desk Jockey
Member
I don't want you to come back. You've hurt my feels with all dis nonsense.
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
I hate the grim some I told you sos. And just want to get you protected is all.
If you have hard floors without any carpet there will be more airborn dust visible in your sunlight test than the same area with carpet.
The only way to truly clean carpet is pull it out and rug wash it. And if it is a Tufted rug you are not going to get it clean so no Tufted Rugs. In the rug cleaning business they call HWE what it really is Surface Cleaning. If you want to get your daycares to have the cleanest environment get them to convert to hard floors with woven rugs that can be cleaned and then wash/clean the rugs. Anything else is Appearance Cleaning.
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
I understand everything you have stated, I just want to see if any iaq tests have been performed as more and more companies use the puxie juice and if there is any danger at all associated with it.
And yes all of our facilities with the exception of one has gone to hard surface with area rugs. And a couple of companies in town encap the area rugs for dirt cheap. Reprucussions in the future?
And yes all of our facilities with the exception of one has gone to hard surface with area rugs. And a couple of companies in town encap the area rugs for dirt cheap. Reprucussions in the future?
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
So far there is only one manufacturer with one juice that is certified to be environmentally safe.
And no one has said they have used it.
And no one has said they have used it.
Mikey P
Administrator
Doyle Bloss had this to say..
One of the inherent advantages (or is that built in dangers?) that being around the carpet cleaning industry for over 35 years provides me is historical perspective. What is often the latest fad, or what is often presented as the newest approach, has often been tried and applied before. So it goes with the concept of residue left in the carpet after cleaning. The whole concept of residue left in the carpet after cleaning is one that can lead to a very emotional discussion.
Let’s start as close as we can get to an absolute. If we accept the definition of soiling and residue to include “any material which is foreign to the construction of the carpet,” then we can state with confidence that there is virtually no such thing as a completely residue-free carpet anytime, even following cleaning. Even if the carpet is simply rinsed with pure water or modified water, water is not always residue free. Depending upon its hardness, the mineral content of the water can leave “residue” in the carpet.
A second thing I think we can find common ground on is what “bad residue” constitutes. It is soiling left behind that the cleaning did not/could not remove. The more soil we can physically remove or extract from the carpet during and after the carpet cleaning process, the better. Chemical residue left behind by the carpet cleaning process that can physically abrade or chemically attack the carpet fiber can certainly be labeled as “bad residue.” Chemical residue left behind that is sticky that can actually attract soil and cause the carpet to re-soil faster after cleaning is certainly “bad residue.” While this is conventionally attached to some surfactants and some solvents particularly used in some carpet presprays, it is in actuality a little more complicated than that. But that is a good starting point.
So we are left with two choices – which is better; good cleaning solution residue left behind in the carpet after the carpet cleaning process is completed, or leaving the least amount of total residue behind (low residue cleaning)? It depends upon who you ask and what the absolute goal is. In the 1990’s, when the first discussions of sick building syndrome started, and the first scientifically measured work about what contaminants actually existed in the indoor environment that could harm occupants and users of the building or home, there is no doubt that low residue cleaning was and should be the focus. From an indoor air quality point of view, low residue carpet cleaning is the best. Extracting more soil from the building envelope, and then leaving the last amount of total residue behind was the focus.
If you are fooling yourself into thinking that low residue cleaning is not important from a carpet consumer’s perspective one only has to look at the incredible growth rate and success of independent and franchise cleaning companies alike who have focused on the fact that they leave less residue in the carpet. Just like the “quick drying” marketing of franchises taught us in the 1990’s just how important drying time was to the consumer, the low residue focus of these successful companies should be catching your attention now. If you are looking for the lowest residue possible period, consider using carpet cleaning products likeCleanMaster Blitz with GreaseBreaker Prespray, Quake Prespray,FastBreak Prespray and HydraDri Carpet Extraction Powder. Detergent and Surfactant Free carpet cleaning solutions like CleanMaster HydraFree DFC also excel at low residue carpet cleaning
Then… along came encapsulating cleaning solutions. The idea of “good residue” following the carpet cleaning process is not a new one though. Absorbent compound carpet cleaning methods, such as Host® or Capture®, have long espoused the benefits of some of the cleaning chemical being left behind in carpet as being a “good thing.” These absorbent materials would continue to emulsify soils, and be vacuumed out in subsequent vacuuming’s. Since they claimed they were not sticky by nature, the chemical residue left behind would not contribute to rapid resoiling. Even longstanding low moisture methods such as dry foam shampoo or Crystal Dry®; have long promoted the concept of the idea that some of the residue left behind can serve a positive purpose acting as a soil repelling or resisting agent. More recently, the use of encapsulating surfactants and polymers to develop a new low moisture encapsulation carpet cleaning method has really brought the issue of “good residue” to a new light. Many solutions, including CleanMaster ZipDri Encap TS by HydraMaster actually talk about that in subsequent vacuuming of the carpet, the polymers left behind help keep the appearance of the carpet better longer.
There is no doubt that the combination of these encapsulating surfactants and polymers have taken interim maintenance or appearance retention carpet cleaning to a whole new level. Now, the use of these polymers and encapsulants, along with organic sequestrates, have been combined by HydraMaster into a new additive to hot water extraction carpet cleaning presprays, extraction detergents, and neutralizing rinses called Tritanol® with the stated purpose of cleaning the carpet faster and better, and helping it to stay cleaner longer. You can find this new technology employed in several CleanMaster formulations – Quake HD Prespray, FastBreak HD Prespray, Release with OxyBreak Prespray, HydraClean Carpet Extraction Detergent, RinseFree with OxyBreak Carpet Extraction Detergent, and ClearWater Rinse Neutralizing Rinse – just to name a few.
The fact that some seem to miss out on though is – you can’t claim to be a low residue carpet cleaner while simultaneously stating that you are purposely leaving treatments behind on the carpet which you state will extend the benefits of a clean carpet. Think back to our definition of residue – any material foreign to the construction of the carpet. The argument over which is better – low residue or good residue – will continue to rage on. A lot may well depend upon the types of carpets you are cleaning and the environment they are installed in. Some make the argument that in a low traffic and soiling situation, low residue cleaning makes the most sense. In a high traffic environment with high levels of grease and oil contamination in the carpet, the benefits of “good” residue may well outweigh the benefits of low residue cleaning. There may not be a right or wrong answer here. Just make sure you understand the benefits of what you choose to do and don’t oversell or mislead your customers as to what you are actually accomplishing.
My personal opinion is that just as these things have cycled in and out of what is “vogue” at the moment, they will continue to do the same in the future. Future studies of the “good residue” may well lead to a renewed look at the polymers breaking down into particulates in the carpet that could work their way into the air. On the flip side, perhaps encapsulating soil will reach an even higher level where it can be kept in the carpet and not allowed to be kicked up into the air, or polymers that make vacuuming more and more effective may be developed. Certainly, residual anti-microbial treatments may be the long term answer to dealing with biological contamination in carpeting.
What we do know is that a cleaner environment is a healthier environment. We can also all agree that the physical extraction and removal of the maximum amount of soil from the carpet is ultimately the most important measurement of clean from a healthier indoor environment perspective. Let’s all focus on that.
One of the inherent advantages (or is that built in dangers?) that being around the carpet cleaning industry for over 35 years provides me is historical perspective. What is often the latest fad, or what is often presented as the newest approach, has often been tried and applied before. So it goes with the concept of residue left in the carpet after cleaning. The whole concept of residue left in the carpet after cleaning is one that can lead to a very emotional discussion.
Let’s start as close as we can get to an absolute. If we accept the definition of soiling and residue to include “any material which is foreign to the construction of the carpet,” then we can state with confidence that there is virtually no such thing as a completely residue-free carpet anytime, even following cleaning. Even if the carpet is simply rinsed with pure water or modified water, water is not always residue free. Depending upon its hardness, the mineral content of the water can leave “residue” in the carpet.
A second thing I think we can find common ground on is what “bad residue” constitutes. It is soiling left behind that the cleaning did not/could not remove. The more soil we can physically remove or extract from the carpet during and after the carpet cleaning process, the better. Chemical residue left behind by the carpet cleaning process that can physically abrade or chemically attack the carpet fiber can certainly be labeled as “bad residue.” Chemical residue left behind that is sticky that can actually attract soil and cause the carpet to re-soil faster after cleaning is certainly “bad residue.” While this is conventionally attached to some surfactants and some solvents particularly used in some carpet presprays, it is in actuality a little more complicated than that. But that is a good starting point.
So we are left with two choices – which is better; good cleaning solution residue left behind in the carpet after the carpet cleaning process is completed, or leaving the least amount of total residue behind (low residue cleaning)? It depends upon who you ask and what the absolute goal is. In the 1990’s, when the first discussions of sick building syndrome started, and the first scientifically measured work about what contaminants actually existed in the indoor environment that could harm occupants and users of the building or home, there is no doubt that low residue cleaning was and should be the focus. From an indoor air quality point of view, low residue carpet cleaning is the best. Extracting more soil from the building envelope, and then leaving the last amount of total residue behind was the focus.
If you are fooling yourself into thinking that low residue cleaning is not important from a carpet consumer’s perspective one only has to look at the incredible growth rate and success of independent and franchise cleaning companies alike who have focused on the fact that they leave less residue in the carpet. Just like the “quick drying” marketing of franchises taught us in the 1990’s just how important drying time was to the consumer, the low residue focus of these successful companies should be catching your attention now. If you are looking for the lowest residue possible period, consider using carpet cleaning products likeCleanMaster Blitz with GreaseBreaker Prespray, Quake Prespray,FastBreak Prespray and HydraDri Carpet Extraction Powder. Detergent and Surfactant Free carpet cleaning solutions like CleanMaster HydraFree DFC also excel at low residue carpet cleaning
Then… along came encapsulating cleaning solutions. The idea of “good residue” following the carpet cleaning process is not a new one though. Absorbent compound carpet cleaning methods, such as Host® or Capture®, have long espoused the benefits of some of the cleaning chemical being left behind in carpet as being a “good thing.” These absorbent materials would continue to emulsify soils, and be vacuumed out in subsequent vacuuming’s. Since they claimed they were not sticky by nature, the chemical residue left behind would not contribute to rapid resoiling. Even longstanding low moisture methods such as dry foam shampoo or Crystal Dry®; have long promoted the concept of the idea that some of the residue left behind can serve a positive purpose acting as a soil repelling or resisting agent. More recently, the use of encapsulating surfactants and polymers to develop a new low moisture encapsulation carpet cleaning method has really brought the issue of “good residue” to a new light. Many solutions, including CleanMaster ZipDri Encap TS by HydraMaster actually talk about that in subsequent vacuuming of the carpet, the polymers left behind help keep the appearance of the carpet better longer.
There is no doubt that the combination of these encapsulating surfactants and polymers have taken interim maintenance or appearance retention carpet cleaning to a whole new level. Now, the use of these polymers and encapsulants, along with organic sequestrates, have been combined by HydraMaster into a new additive to hot water extraction carpet cleaning presprays, extraction detergents, and neutralizing rinses called Tritanol® with the stated purpose of cleaning the carpet faster and better, and helping it to stay cleaner longer. You can find this new technology employed in several CleanMaster formulations – Quake HD Prespray, FastBreak HD Prespray, Release with OxyBreak Prespray, HydraClean Carpet Extraction Detergent, RinseFree with OxyBreak Carpet Extraction Detergent, and ClearWater Rinse Neutralizing Rinse – just to name a few.
The fact that some seem to miss out on though is – you can’t claim to be a low residue carpet cleaner while simultaneously stating that you are purposely leaving treatments behind on the carpet which you state will extend the benefits of a clean carpet. Think back to our definition of residue – any material foreign to the construction of the carpet. The argument over which is better – low residue or good residue – will continue to rage on. A lot may well depend upon the types of carpets you are cleaning and the environment they are installed in. Some make the argument that in a low traffic and soiling situation, low residue cleaning makes the most sense. In a high traffic environment with high levels of grease and oil contamination in the carpet, the benefits of “good” residue may well outweigh the benefits of low residue cleaning. There may not be a right or wrong answer here. Just make sure you understand the benefits of what you choose to do and don’t oversell or mislead your customers as to what you are actually accomplishing.
My personal opinion is that just as these things have cycled in and out of what is “vogue” at the moment, they will continue to do the same in the future. Future studies of the “good residue” may well lead to a renewed look at the polymers breaking down into particulates in the carpet that could work their way into the air. On the flip side, perhaps encapsulating soil will reach an even higher level where it can be kept in the carpet and not allowed to be kicked up into the air, or polymers that make vacuuming more and more effective may be developed. Certainly, residual anti-microbial treatments may be the long term answer to dealing with biological contamination in carpeting.
What we do know is that a cleaner environment is a healthier environment. We can also all agree that the physical extraction and removal of the maximum amount of soil from the carpet is ultimately the most important measurement of clean from a healthier indoor environment perspective. Let’s all focus on that.
Mikey P
Administrator
mirf
Supportive Member
Really, you are worried about pixie dust?
Take a good look at what you're eating everyday.
You don't want to do that. Never read the ingredients on the side panel. It can change you more than this board.
encapman
Member
DFE certification doesn't mean that other products are not safe. Not at all! What it means is this... Each of the raw ingredients in a DFE formulation have been certified by the EPA as safe for the environment. Does that mean that products made with non-certified ingredients are not safe? Not necessarily. Many non-certified products can also be safe, they're just not certified. Certification costs money, and making a product with only certified raw ingredients can add to the cost of manufacturing. There are safe alternatives, built with components that are equally safe; they simply don't carry a certification. If certification is important to a customer, or if there's a concern with a particular account that requires a "green" product, then a product like Bio-Encap can get the job done nicely. So if you're overly concerned about being certifiably green, you can go with a certified product. At the end of the day though, all the Releasit encap shampoos have a very low impact on the environment.
D Rice
Member
I hope your not high speed buffing those hard floors. Creates a lot of bad stuff floating in the air, think about the liability.
Art Kelley
Supportive Member
Michaels concerns were not actually addressed. I lost both my father and my brother to cancer from workplace chemical toxins. They are a very real concern in our industry. How does this pixie dust effect our lungs, our bloodstream, our organs. Does it remain in our bodies for extended periods of time? Because as sure as the sun, we are breathing this in, in effect ingesting it, especially if it is broadly presprayed prior to the mechanical agitation.
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
We use hepa air scrubbers when we buff the floors thank you for your concern.
encapman
Member
I understand your concern and I can empathize with you. I'm very sorry for your loss!!! Yet I think we may be freaking ourselves out here for no reason whatsoever. If there was a possibility of toxicity, the EPA would not certify the ingredients as safe for the environment. And if any ingredient of a product was a possible carcinogen, you would see that health concern listed on the MSDS sheet - that's the law. I honestly think you're concern with relation to an encap polymer is unfounded. There are many many other things that you come in contact with in your daily world that you should more rightly worry about. Things that are far more likely to cause you harm than an inert polymer. What about the soil that was in the carpet to begin with - now there's something to be concerned about. Or what about the carbon monoxide from your truck mount? What about your waste water that's filled with chemicals and laden with soil and contaminants? What about that pungent smell that comes out of your waste tank? What about, what about, what about? Life is messy. We try to take calculated risks and protect ourselves to the extent possible. Read the labels, read the MSDS sheets, and decide for yourselves. But there is no need to create a monster where no monster exists.
P.S. How many of you eat at McDonalds?
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Desk Jockey
Member
Art for the applicator its usually shower fed through a Cimex so not much change of anyone inhaling particulate.
After its dried, the cleaner generally isn't there, however if it were to become airborne it would happen while vacuuming. If the janitors are using a HEPA vacuums that possibility is diminished even further.
I don't think Michael has an idea how it would become a problem, he is just throwing out there that he is concerned "what if" it happened.
After its dried, the cleaner generally isn't there, however if it were to become airborne it would happen while vacuuming. If the janitors are using a HEPA vacuums that possibility is diminished even further.
I don't think Michael has an idea how it would become a problem, he is just throwing out there that he is concerned "what if" it happened.
Desk Jockey
Member
That would control settled dust but if you are working in that environment you become the HEPA filter. To be safe you should wear at least an N-95.
Do they sell them in Texas or do you want me to send you some?
Art Kelley
Supportive Member
Richard, when I use encap I spray it down and red pad it with my 360i bonnet head. Works great. I've been using this stuff more and more on commercial carpets, then I rinse most of it out where the appearance will be improved by the removal of this slurry. The only chemical I normally use with this much chemical exposure is Grease Eraser, which uses a food grade phosphate as it's active cleaning ingredient and I have great confidence in it's safety.
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
That would control settled dust but if you are working in that environment you become the HEPA filter. To be safe you should wear at least an N-95.
Do they sell them in Texas or do you want me to send you some?
No they don't please send me 4 sets please!
Desk Jockey
Member
Keep the spray down low and make sure the droplet size is large enough so you're not breathing in a lot of vapor. Not just for Encap products but for all chems you spray.
Desk Jockey
Member
Send me the address to send them & the BILL.
Shane Deubell
Supportive Member
- Joined
- Jun 30, 2011
- Messages
- 4,052
That is the funniest part, he does vct.
My gawd floor stripper and finish are about the worst chemicals you can use.
Plus high speeding as mentioned.
