Rumors from within..

Shane Deubell

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Joined
Jun 30, 2011
Messages
4,052
I understand that Shane, I was taking you at the literal word.

"Should be in the 40's" is not 40K

Without qualifying what you get at a certain price point , the cost figure gets a bit muddy

Bottom line is a Butler System in a van with only 10k is gonna run you around 50k not 40K.

Reconditioned systems are definitely a way to save dough


I have a quote from Butler on my desk for a new system that is priced at $64,000 so I assume the quoted price of $70k that Dave Gill mentioned is a fully loaded van and fully optioned Butler System

I'm a big fan of Butler and yes the equipment is expensive, but when numbers are just thrown out there it will no time before someone claims you need to drain your 401k to purchase a new Butler:surprised:

C'mon fred its the internet...

But yes i was off it was 14k miles at $41k and 21k miles at $44k.
My bad :biggrin:
 

davegillfishing

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Nov 25, 2006
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2,229
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st augustine fla
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dave gill
Yea my butlers are loaded with options. Big tanks filter bags elect reels and all

Not enough revenue from butlers? Not the problem here. Over 200k a year with the butler.

My biggest problem with buying another is I'm trying to be a debt free company and pay cash for everything. It will take me some to save 70k but maybe it's the thing. Who knows.

I have options to explore for sure.
 

Ken Snow

RIP
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Bingham Farms MI
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Ken Snow
Why pay cash when money is so cheap right now Dave? U could probably make 3 times the return if you put your cash to work in non depreciating assets.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
 

davegillfishing

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st augustine fla
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dave gill
i dont disagree with ya ken but at one time in my life i was strapped down and had no breathing room..it is so nice to be debt free that its hard for me to even think if owing money on anything..

my accountant and i have had some heated discussion on the matter and i have money around making money for me..i just cringe at not owning whats mine..i admit it sounds goofy till i dont have to open any bills

each month..then its nice. lol

it took us many years to get to this point..we lost a few rental homes and were eating hamburger helper for a long while because of being extended when business dropped off..we promised ourselves it would never happen again

no matter what..so here we are..if we want it we buy it then save to replace what we took out lol...i know it sounds goofy but we all have something goofy we do.
 

Ken Snow

RIP
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Messages
6,987
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Bingham Farms MI
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Ken Snow
Doesn't sound goofy Dave sounds human. We're all products of our experiences and I honor your choices! I can def see how it would feel good to not have debt.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
 

cu

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Joined
Dec 9, 2006
Messages
1,402
Location
San Lorenzo Ca
Name
Cu
I'm with you on the debt free life. I would love it. But it will take me years to get there..our biggest nut being the house.
your Judson was a good choice. I'm sure both Les and Dick have reached out to you about the install . Anyhow I've
had my Judson 4 or 5 years now and it never let's me down. Both my reactor and TNT have had little or no down time.

in my business dealing with the Judson ,s they have been top notch.
 

idreadnought

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Joined
Apr 5, 2009
Messages
883
Location
Oroville, ca
Name
Richard
what were you hoping to accomplish Richard?


lower price? better performance? better reliability? or just something to do....


I was trying to create a simple design that had 0 problems and very high vac performance. I like performer machines but since then I think the current machines are over engineered and with the electronics they do have more issues than the past.



Lesson learned, too much time to build, too expensive final cost and its the little stuff that kicks your butt.

Machine project began with a nissan engine from a datsun 210 that I had rebuilt. Then I used a roots ram 406 blower. cat 290 pump. coolant heat exchangers from a hydramaster machine. stainless post blower exchanger after the coolant ones that was custom made. The ram 406 blower get about 35 degrees higher than other blowers. I was going to put aftermarket fuel injection system on it.

Problems I ran into:

Fabrication went well but I ran into a lot of issues with unkowns that came up during final assembly: because of my belt design and limited lengths I had to move blower and then I had to move entire top frame of machine back because of aligment issues. The machine has a base frame and then the top frame that sits on rubber mounts.

Fuel injection took me forever because the system I was using hadn't been used often triggering it off the negative on the coil. After talking to the manufacturer and trying everything I finally scrapped it and put a webber carb on it.

The blower heat exchanger was designed to be put directly under the blower. However due to the pulsation of the blower the vibration litterly destroyed the heat exchanger. I scrapped it and only use the coolant exchangers.

The belt design recomended by gates was a toothed belt design. I was really excited because that type of belt has an extremly long service life with almost no issues. I had parts machined to adapt pulleys to the engine. As it turns out rotary lobe blowers do not work well with toothed belts. so it has been breaking a belt once a month. I am changing the drive system tomorow to v belts. John Olsen hooked me up with a performer flywheel that bolts right up (thank you John).

I will also have to change the pump to a 3cp1120 because the pulley on the performer that will drive the pump will spin the cat 290 too fast. Cat 290 has a limit of 1200 rpm and the 3cp can spin 1750.


Goods, As long as the bx belts hold up and they should the machine will be very reliable. Over 400 cfm, heat that is plenty for me, very little vibration because of the rubber mounts. 110 gallon stainless tank.

Bads, machine is heavy, Time and cost to build was not worth the investment in both.
 

cu

Supportive Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2006
Messages
1,402
Location
San Lorenzo Ca
Name
Cu
I was trying to create a simple design that had 0 problems and very high vac performance. I like performer machines but since then I think the current machines are over engineered and with the electronics they do have more issues than the past.



Lesson learned, too much time to build, too expensive final cost and its the little stuff that kicks your butt.

Machine project began with a nissan engine from a datsun 210 that I had rebuilt. Then I used a roots ram 406 blower. cat 290 pump. coolant heat exchangers from a hydramaster machine. stainless post blower exchanger after the coolant ones that was custom made. The ram 406 blower get about 35 degrees higher than other blowers. I was going to put aftermarket fuel injection system on it.

Problems I ran into:

Fabrication went well but I ran into a lot of issues with unkowns that came up during final assembly: because of my belt design and limited lengths I had to move blower and then I had to move entire top frame of machine back because of aligment issues. The machine has a base frame and then the top frame that sits on rubber mounts.

Fuel injection took me forever because the system I was using hadn't been used often triggering it off the negative on the coil. After talking to the manufacturer and trying everything I finally scrapped it and put a webber carb on it.

The blower heat exchanger was designed to be put directly under the blower. However due to the pulsation of the blower the vibration litterly destroyed the heat exchanger. I scrapped it and only use the coolant exchangers.

The belt design recomended by gates was a toothed belt design. I was really excited because that type of belt has an extremly long service life with almost no issues. I had parts machined to adapt pulleys to the engine. As it turns out rotary lobe blowers do not work well with toothed belts. so it has been breaking a belt once a month. I am changing the drive system tomorow to v belts. John Olsen hooked me up with a performer flywheel that bolts right up (thank you John).

I will also have to change the pump to a 3cp1120 because the pulley on the performer that will drive the pump will spin the cat 290 too fast. Cat 290 has a limit of 1200 rpm and the 3cp can spin 1750.


Goods, As long as the bx belts hold up and they should the machine will be very reliable. Over 400 cfm, heat that is plenty for me, very little vibration because of the rubber mounts. 110 gallon stainless tank.

Bads, machine is heavy, Time and cost to build was not worth the investment in both.

Or you could have called Judson and asked for a reactor.
 

Zee

Supportive Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2007
Messages
6,162
Location
SoCal jungle
Name
.
I was trying to create a simple design that had 0 problems and very high vac performance. I like performer machines but since then I think the current machines are over engineered and with the electronics they do have more issues than the past.



Lesson learned, too much time to build, too expensive final cost and its the little stuff that kicks your butt.

Machine project began with a nissan engine from a datsun 210 that I had rebuilt. Then I used a roots ram 406 blower. cat 290 pump. coolant heat exchangers from a hydramaster machine. stainless post blower exchanger after the coolant ones that was custom made. The ram 406 blower get about 35 degrees higher than other blowers. I was going to put aftermarket fuel injection system on it.

Problems I ran into:

Fabrication went well but I ran into a lot of issues with unkowns that came up during final assembly: because of my belt design and limited lengths I had to move blower and then I had to move entire top frame of machine back because of aligment issues. The machine has a base frame and then the top frame that sits on rubber mounts.

Fuel injection took me forever because the system I was using hadn't been used often triggering it off the negative on the coil. After talking to the manufacturer and trying everything I finally scrapped it and put a webber carb on it.

The blower heat exchanger was designed to be put directly under the blower. However due to the pulsation of the blower the vibration litterly destroyed the heat exchanger. I scrapped it and only use the coolant exchangers.

The belt design recomended by gates was a toothed belt design. I was really excited because that type of belt has an extremly long service life with almost no issues. I had parts machined to adapt pulleys to the engine. As it turns out rotary lobe blowers do not work well with toothed belts. so it has been breaking a belt once a month. I am changing the drive system tomorow to v belts. John Olsen hooked me up with a performer flywheel that bolts right up (thank you John).

I will also have to change the pump to a 3cp1120 because the pulley on the performer that will drive the pump will spin the cat 290 too fast. Cat 290 has a limit of 1200 rpm and the 3cp can spin 1750.


Goods, As long as the bx belts hold up and they should the machine will be very reliable. Over 400 cfm, heat that is plenty for me, very little vibration because of the rubber mounts. 110 gallon stainless tank.

Bads, machine is heavy, Time and cost to build was not worth the investment in both.


Pictures?
 

davegillfishing

Supportive Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2006
Messages
2,229
Location
st augustine fla
Name
dave gill
I'm with you on the debt free life. I would love it. But it will take me years to get there..our biggest nut being the house.
your Judson was a good choice. I'm sure both Les and Dick have reached out to you about the install . Anyhow I've
had my Judson 4 or 5 years now and it never let's me down. Both my reactor and TNT have had little or no down time.

in my business dealing with the Judson ,s they have been top notch.


Nope...only heard from less once just after I picked up the truck when he knew I wasn't happy with some of the install but I told him to not worry over it I'd just deal with it. Then not long after is when I found everything else.

Sad thing is he knows the install wasn't a good one because he commented that he should have had me come to sc instead of fla because Dick was still recovering from a surgery or something.

But nope. Not a word from them
 

Zee

Supportive Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2007
Messages
6,162
Location
SoCal jungle
Name
.
Sorry Zee, I meant to dealt most of that and give Judson time to respond.



Dont put the Poppy Corn away just yet.




Lol. Who doesn't like a bit of drama? But I always hate to see good people go down in unnecessary drama...

Anyways....popcorn ain't poppin yet..
 

Dan

Supportive Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2006
Messages
979
Location
Beaumont, Ca
Name
Dan
ultimately were are all stuck at the mercy of the government mandates and we can all only hope that our great truckmount manufactures pull us thru.
 

davegillfishing

Supportive Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2006
Messages
2,229
Location
st augustine fla
Name
dave gill
No popcorn needed.

Like I had said many times less, dick and Judson products are great. It was the install I had a problem with

Dick called me today and apologized for the issues and made a offer that I would have made. And one that proves how prideful and respectful the Judson's are.

He simply told me to tell him what he had to do to fix the issue..send money, redo the install or whatever I wanted.

That statement says a lot for how he cared about just fixing the problem and nothing else. He just wanted me happy.

My response was that I didn't want anything other than them to be aware of the problem and fix it so it doesn't happen to someone that is not in a position to fix the problems like I was.
and fix the problem before their awesome reputation was ruined.

It's clear to me that these guys are serious about customer service and satisfaction. Many things went wrong with this install all the way down to communication and trusting their guys without checking on quality of work.

Dick assured me that the issues were going to be addressed and that's all I wanted nothing else.

Dick is working with me on getting the heat issued figured out and vowed to stand by me till its perfect.

He asked me to not give up on them over this one problem and I won't. This is water under the bridge and as far as I'm concerned was handled like a pro by dick.

Less is a great guy but seems to get a bit wrapped up in the boards and gets offended instead of just continuing to do what they do best.

My advice to less would be to keep on making a awesome machine and providing the great customer service you are known for and ignore the haters and craziness just stick to what you know and do best and ignore everything else.

Dave
 

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